mucilofamucil (mucilofamucil) wrote in shoresofavalon,
mucilofamucil
mucilofamucil
shoresofavalon

Not Done With Tomorrow's Dodo Birds

http://www.obesity.org/subs/fastfacts/obesity_what2.shtml

I need help understanding this issue. There are a few questions I have specifically, but in general I would like to understand why people have sympathy for the obese.


"Inadequate insurance coverage limits access to treatment [of obesity]."

Isn't the "cure" to obesity not eating as much? Doesn't this involve saving money, rather than spending it? Why is an investment needed for treatment?

"The tendency toward obesity is fostered by our environment: lack of physical activity combined with high-calorie, low-cost foods."

This seems to imply that obesity is caused people's choices to eat poor foods and not excersize. How is obesity more disease-like than an infected tatoo? Aren't negative consequences of negative behaviors simply the Darwin way we all know and love?

"Persons with obesity are victims of employment and other discrimination, and are penalized for their condition despite many federal and state laws and policies."

Isn't this a good thing? I mean, I don't want anyone to be forced to hire ugly people for their glam magazine. I don't want anyone to be forced to hire someone so fat that they make the hotel patrons gag right at the reception desk. If I were on an airplane, you're damn right I'm going to demand that the fat-ass buy an extra seat so I don't have to sit under his/her jelly-rolls in coach. What exactly do obese people want from the responsible people?

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/D?c109:12:./temp/~c109IJwrib::

Here's a 2005 Bill giving a beaurocracy authority to spend money on obesity prevention. Hmmm... it's seems like they recommend information as a solution to obesity. Is obesity a nice word for "fat because of idiocy"? Last time I remember disease solutions came in the form of medicine. It's not like we should acknowledge the "too stupid to save up for retirement" disease just because it's sad.

"Being obese and being overweight are not the same condition. A BMI of 30 or more is considered obese and a BMI between 25 to 29.9 is considered overweight."

How is someone with a BMI of 29.9 not considered obese? What, other than BMI alone, makes a person with a 29.9 BMI less DISEASED than someone of a 30 BMI? Quite frankly, I've met cage fighters with 30+ BMI that are healthier than fat drug users under 30 BMI, so how am I going to convince these people that they have a serious disease which needs to be addressed and solved by the collective public?
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I take offense with your post, your questions, and you. This post seems to be more of one huge insult to the overweight, rather than one wanting to spur conversation and debate.

If I were on an airplane, you're damn right I'm going to demand that the fat-ass buy an extra seat so I don't have to sit under his/her jelly-rolls in coach.

Fat-ass? Not that I'm condoning insults, but if you're going to insult my being overweight, please do it with some maturity.


That being said, I see you as nothing more than a bigot.

One last thing. In your application, you chose one quote to sum up your attitude for life.

"Love thy neighbor as thy self."

I'm scratching my head wondering how that factors in with your bigotry.
Thank you for responding!

"I take offense with your post, your questions, and you."

The ability to take offense is a symptom of low self-esteem. I'm sorry if this is the case for you.

"This post seems to be more of one huge insult to the overweight, rather than one wanting to spur conversation and debate."

You are mistaken; this post is an insult to fat people that believe themselves diseased and/or fat people that believe the government should subsidize the health industry. For instance, my good friend is obese but he's completely content with his condition and has the attitude of someone who has pride for a poorly drawn tattoo; I'm certainly not insulting him or any other fat person (intrinsically) with my remarks.

"Fat-ass? Not that I'm condoning insults, but if you're going to insult my being overweight, please do it with some maturity."

I do not know how to insult with maturity, but I did not intend to insult. People that find facts insulting generally have little self-esteem. I'm sorry if this is the case for you.

You seem to be upset because you are overweight. Why? Do you consider yourself diseased? Do you support government subsidies of the medical/health industry? If so, please support your opinion rather than trolling on these forums with nothing to express but disaproval.

"One last thing. In your application, you chose one quote to sum up your attitude for life - Love thy neighbor as thy self. I'm scratching my head wondering how that factors in with your bigotry."

Let me tell you why you are confused. You seem to think that love and bigotry are incompatible; this is not true. Or haven't you met Christians? Anyways, "love your neighbor as yourself" isn't my mantra because I have some invalid deontic logic to impose on others about the nature of love, but because I treat others how I care to be treated: with liberty. Now you should understand why your assumptions made you confused when my message is clear. Since you probably never considered that a bigot who doesn't love himself/herself could be an asshole to people and not break the Golden Rule, I can understand why you would wrongly assume that your perception of love trancends to all people that reference love.

"Brotha please, you're the one who's trippin'! Now go on! Cry home to your momma! She waitin' for ya! Now how you gonna act?"
As a moderator of this community, it is my responsibility to ensure that the purpose of this community is both clearly defined and ultimately adhered to.

As stated, this community was formed to encourage and facilitate discussion and debate on subjects of interest to its members. The rules require civility, courtesy, and respect in initial posts and comments alike. Belittling, name-calling, judging, as well as sarcasm, derision, and outright attacks are not permitted.

It would seem that you have misconstrued our purpose, as well as the reason for your inclusion in this community.

When a member proffers a subject for discussion, it is expected that he/she is genuinely interested in expanding their knowledge of that subject, through comments and conversation with other members.

Please leave your stereotypes, insults, condescension, and general rudeness at the door. The seemingly intentional creation of drama is not welcome
here.

If you would like to reformat your original post in a question format suitable for discussion, I think it might be must better received by the members.
Ooh. I move to put "belittling, name-calling, and outright attacks" and "judging, sarcasm, and derision" under two entirely different categories...while the first is never appropriate, the second are surely not evil in moderation...and I'll be damned if "judging" is disallowed.

That being said:

GUYSSS PLEASE DON'T FIGHT? There are so many more awesome things to talk about.
"When a member proffers a subject for discussion, it is expected that he/she is genuinely interested in expanding their knowledge of that subject"

See, now that is an excellent way to put things. Well worded.

I'm inclined to be lasse faire about these things. To let people be how they want to be. Interact how they wish, especially because the community is in such a fledgling state, I feel any activity is good activity, but I'm sure you'll argue that it's fledgling state is the very reason this behavior needs to be put in check. Any way I look at it, I really am in love with this guiding principle you've put out. I think it belongs on the user info.

"When members proffer a subject for discussion, it is expected that they are genuinely interested in expanding their knowledge of that subject."

(I pluralized it so all the grammar's in sync.)
"Since you probably never considered that a bigot who doesn't love himself/herself could be an asshole to people and not break the Golden Rule"

I don't know if that works out logically, because the basis of the commandment is rooted in the word, Love. Jesus isn't attributed to have said treat or approach but love, so one possible interpretation is to infer that he meant to first imply Love yourself. THEN, Love your neighbor as yourself. I've always thought it to be a funny loop hole. Masochists feel love through others hurting them. So, the Golden Rule tells them to show their love by causing others pain.

Even though, technically, you support yourself well, you've got to know your stlye seems intended to ruffle feathers.

"this post is an insult to fat people that believe themselves diseased"

Weeeeeell,... MOSTLY that's the case, but you do stray a bit. For instance, how does an obese person trying to sit in a seat on a plane fit into the "belief in obesity as a disease" crowd? He's just trying to sit in a seat.

I don't think disease is the right word for obesity. I do believe obesity can be altered by behavior change. But I do sympathize with people who are obese. Genes do control apetite and metabolism. The obese are obese because they are going with the flow. They can choose to fight the flow, but if they don't, I'm not going to call them a fat ass.

I look at obesity like personality. I feel like if I really tried I could be more extroverted. But I'm introverted. I'm comfortable with that. I'm going with the flow of where my genes and early childhood development placed me. I could choose to fight the flow, but I don't. So I can't very well blame an obese person for not fighting their condition. That'd make me somewhat hypocritical. I know there are many more negative consequences with obesity, but the basic principles of control are pretty similar.